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- Thread starter Crusty181
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Was planning to take a Mux for a drive Friday was too busy with work. Although payload is a worry need a long range tank...
@achjimmy 4 kids and a 22 van so I worry most will handle it payload.. Which leaves Cruiser, Patrol or Disco..
Love a Crusier although unless I lease just cannot afford a newer one..
@achjimmy 4 kids and a 22 van so I worry most will handle it payload.. Which leaves Cruiser, Patrol or Disco..
Love a Crusier although unless I lease just cannot afford a newer one..
That was the original plan replace the mini with something mid 20's. Although with the cost of fixing things on the Disco each time it sneezes now not sure which one to upgrade.
Mate has a 80 series that just goes goes slowly
Guy on Myswag just picked up a super clean 200 petrol for about $32k hard to find a better rig for the $$$
Are there long range tanks in the Petrols 200's
Filling at petrol pumps with van attached is another pain in the ...
Filling at petrol pumps with van attached is another pain in the ...
Depends on the model pre 2011 (after they all get it) but you can have 138 liters standard then up that to 170 before needing wheel carriers etc I don't know what they drink towing maybe 22-23? Even 25 gives you close to 500kms towing
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A really interesting thread to read but is making my head hurt. My story so far is....called into a Jayco yard recently whilst away on holidays. Wife looked at a 2007 Jayco Sterling 21 ft van that she really really liked. Spoke with a sales rep who said 'yep, no worries, your Prado can tow it' Which it probably can but after reading this thread, I don't believe it can be done legally. The van compliance plate records a Tare of 2084kg; GTM of 2406kg; and ATM of 2559kg. The Prado has a tow capacity of 2500kg; max ball weight of 250kg. From other reading I've done, the simplest explanation that I found (and could easily understand) was that the ATM needs to be less than the vehicle's tow capacity. So to me, it seems the Prado can not legally tow the van, yet the salesman is saying its okay. I haven't questioned him further on this point yet.
Is my simple assessment valid or are there more factors that I need to consider? The van is currently unregistered. Will it / should it be weighed as part of the regn process? I don't know if rego has just lapsed or whether the van is from out of state.
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Short answer NO, never listen to salesmen........some actually do know what they are talking about but if you don't know about something then you will never know if they do, selling a product is what they do...................With your Prado if the max weight of van is nearly 2500kg and thats the tow cap of your tug, you have kids then honestly you will more than likely max out your weights, trying to keep it simple you will need to look for a van with a max of at most 2 ton as even then you will be close to the GCM, I have no doubt that the Prado can handle more but if you want to be legal thats probably it..............
Thanks @Drover. Good points. No kids; only a couple of dogs that barely make 10kg together. Only been six months since I upgraded the tug from a Kluger to the Prado to better suit the bigger and heavier Millard van (previous van was a 12ft Jayco expanda). I had no plans in my future for another dreaded cycle - bigger van; higher rated tug. Only so much money in the retirement bucket. Naively thought my better half was more than happy with the current set-up (can probably tell I haven't been a caravaner for very long
)
Agree with @Drover if you have a Prado 150 @Curryhouse then your total or GCM should be 5370kg (looks like you have the same model as me so figures are the same) so the GVM of the Prado is 2990 so if you minus the 2990 from the 5370 you get really what the max of the van's ATM should be which is 2380kg. Remember that the most you can put into the car including people is the 2990kg, if you can reduce what you put into the car weight wise and it is less than 2990kg's then you could possibly increase the max ATM to whatever the difference is. Even if you got the van re-plated to 2490 you are more than likely going to be over your GCM.
We were in a similar position when deciding on a van and lucky for us we found one that had an ATM of 2330kg's so covered us (that is if the weigh in at the Jayco factory is correct which is the whole point of this post....... good luck
We were in a similar position when deciding on a van and lucky for us we found one that had an ATM of 2330kg's so covered us (that is if the weigh in at the Jayco factory is correct
which is the whole point of this post....... good luck
I've read about this subject in other Forum's (the argumentative ones). There are people who claim that so long as at the time of being weighed by Transport Inspectors etc that the van physically weighs less than the plated amount, doesn't exceed the GCM, doesn't exceed the cars tow rating or towball limit then you are OK, even if the vans plated figure exceeds the car or towbar rating. Personally, without any such approval in writing, I would not try on that argument.
When going through all this in choosing our van the one big thing that I liked about the Work n Play as against so many other more traditional vans was that it had an owner usable limit of 600Kg as against so many others of 300Kg or less. I have no fear about travelling with both tanks full, even to the point that I'm planning a 3rd tank just for pure drinking quality water. We do have the advantage of no kids and a low weight fur kid who probably won't last much longer anyway. Initially the van did exceed the plated towball weight by quite a margin but rearrangement of some things has fixed that.
With the rating of the Ranger and with this van I'm sure that we're nowhere near limits so far and I like the margin that is there. As a part of registering in the NT temporarily before picking up the van in Adelaide I was required to take it through an NT Govt rego test shed. They put us over the scales in Alice and were only concerned with the van details and it's as it was there weight but didn't check ball weight or the car itself. The van was well under even with the excess items we were carrying then for delivery back to home. While they were finalising the paperwork we did do those other weights ourselves. Still have them all somewhere but a waste of time as I've altered so many things. Some things out, others in. Have not weighed it since other than with the ball scales I have and is around 260Kg in touring condition.
One water tank is in front of front axle and the other to rear of back axle. Currently there's an equal size 90 litre grey water tank between the axles but I'll probably move that to front and 3rd tank in its place. This should almost add nothing to ball weight as rarely is there much in the waste tank.
When going through all this in choosing our van the one big thing that I liked about the Work n Play as against so many other more traditional vans was that it had an owner usable limit of 600Kg as against so many others of 300Kg or less. I have no fear about travelling with both tanks full, even to the point that I'm planning a 3rd tank just for pure drinking quality water. We do have the advantage of no kids and a low weight fur kid who probably won't last much longer anyway. Initially the van did exceed the plated towball weight by quite a margin but rearrangement of some things has fixed that.
With the rating of the Ranger and with this van I'm sure that we're nowhere near limits so far and I like the margin that is there. As a part of registering in the NT temporarily before picking up the van in Adelaide I was required to take it through an NT Govt rego test shed. They put us over the scales in Alice and were only concerned with the van details and it's as it was there weight but didn't check ball weight or the car itself. The van was well under even with the excess items we were carrying then for delivery back to home. While they were finalising the paperwork we did do those other weights ourselves. Still have them all somewhere but a waste of time as I've altered so many things. Some things out, others in. Have not weighed it since other than with the ball scales I have and is around 260Kg in touring condition.
One water tank is in front of front axle and the other to rear of back axle. Currently there's an equal size 90 litre grey water tank between the axles but I'll probably move that to front and 3rd tank in its place. This should almost add nothing to ball weight as rarely is there much in the waste tank.
My rule of thumb is if it sits well, tows as a stable platform and doesn't try to shove me around then it must be good. The main thing is if you don't really need it then leave it at home and that includes water, making sure you have good rubber, correct tyre pressures on van and tug is more important than worrying about some bogeymen with scales and tape measure.
If your stupid and attract attention you will get looked at otherwise all is good, the scare mongers will try to put the wind up you but they are just full of it.
Hit the road and enjoy it.......
If your stupid and attract attention you will get looked at otherwise all is good, the scare mongers will try to put the wind up you but they are just full of it.
Hit the road and enjoy it.......
Agter towing our 17 with prado yes towed it well but i would not want to tow a much bigger van with one as size dose matter the 17 looks huge behind prado not being scary just my thoughts great tow car with van that suits it its such a shame there not 3 tonne towing but you still have the weight of it i think you want to be much heavier than what your towing ?????? My two cents after towing with one put an EGT gauge on it to make sure your not over doing the motor ??????
@burnsie, thanks for the feedback and your example using the Prado's data. Most helpful. Reading this thread and and other information on the web has made me much more aware of load and weight requirements when it comes to towing a van responsibly.
So a little bit more to my story. I called the salesman back and asked him directly about ATM vs GTM and legal towing. He assured me that the GTM was the key weight when determining whether a vehicle was legal to tow. Searched the NSW RTA website and found the following info under 'Road rules / Towing';
**********
Towing ratio requirement
The loaded mass of the trailer must not exceed the lesser of:
***********
I assume (rightly or wrongly) that the 'loaded mass of the trailer' = GTM. However no specific use of the terms ATM or GTM which I thought would be a help.
My head still hurts........
So a little bit more to my story. I called the salesman back and asked him directly about ATM vs GTM and legal towing. He assured me that the GTM was the key weight when determining whether a vehicle was legal to tow. Searched the NSW RTA website and found the following info under 'Road rules / Towing';
**********
Towing ratio requirement
The loaded mass of the trailer must not exceed the lesser of:
- Rated capacity of the towbar and tow coupling.
- Maximum towing capacity of the vehicle.
- Maximum carrying capacity of the trailer.
- Maximum rated carrying capacity of the tyres.
- One and a half times the unladen mass of the towing vehicle, provided that the trailer is fitted with brakes which are connected and in working order, or
- The unladen mass of the towing vehicle if the trailer does not require brakes.
***********
I assume (rightly or wrongly) that the 'loaded mass of the trailer' = GTM. However no specific use of the terms ATM or GTM which I thought would be a help.
My head still hurts........
@PhilD that's correct. There was somebody on here even had a letter from SA transport explaining it exactly like that. Think of it the same as a car trailer. Tare 400kg rated 4000kg if you put a Hyundai on it you can tow it with a kluger. Load a cruiser on it and you might need to go find a F truck to tow it. It's pretty simple it's your weight not the plate. I really don't see how people can see this any other way? But I guess people just overthink a situation.
Thanks @Drover. Good points. No kids; only a couple of dogs that barely make 10kg together. Only been six months since I upgraded the tug from a Kluger to the Prado to better suit the bigger and heavier Millard van (previous van was a 12ft Jayco expanda). I had no plans in my future for another dreaded cycle - bigger van; higher rated tug. Only so much money in the retirement bucket. Naively thought my better half was more than happy with the current set-up (can probably tell I haven't been a caravaner for very long
@Curryhouse there is a company in Newcastel that can re engineer the older 150 Prado and up the GVM to 3000kg
I might have asked this before? Given that we don't actually know anybody who has been done or even weighed other than our aunts, gardeners wife's 2nd cousin . What do you reckon the tolerance would be? What is it on trucks? Somebody told me 10% ? Weighbridge operator told me the scales are plus/Minus 20kgs. Just curious.
They will jump on truckies for being a ton over, but then the rig can be 42 ton so a van being 50kg over could be in trouble. The basic would be they would weigh the whole rig first and if over the GCM for the tug then your in Poo but honestly it would be a lot of work for a scaly to set up for a van especially a mobile site.
Being over 4.2t gross (I think) you could attract HV fines......need to look into the can of worms, does it come under state or federal ?
Head back in sand ,oh grab another beer first.
Being over 4.2t gross (I think) you could attract HV fines......need to look into the can of worms, does it come under state or federal ?
Head back in sand ,oh grab another beer first.