Switching to lithium

Drover

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Thanks for you reference about toasters, @garfield28 while I was in Gympie I remembered to stop at BCF and buy some mesh for mine, I know you would think I would just cut some out of metal flyscreen, the thing about getting old sometimes you just cant be stuffed, anyway I have enough now so my tiaster will last another 20 yrs...... We test our smoke alarm daily as well when in van.
 

garfield28

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We never had a milk frother, other than a kid on the end of a straw in a glass if milk........ Cuppuchino is just a warm coffee flavoured milk shake, mans coffee doesn't have milk or froth ..:bounce::boink:

Love my milk froth Drover. I have a mokapot and have been reluctantly making coffee from it for the last 2 trips having it with just milk. Well on the weekend I frothed some milk on the butane stove (took forever) and by golly it was a better tasting coffee than my machine at home with fresh ground beans in it.

You always know who is having toast for brekky when the smoke detectors start going off all around the place

Mine was flat out toasting let a lone burning on the weekend poor but proud. I started outside on the butne and with the wind it just wasn't happening, so moved inside and still seemed to take forever.

I love my camping and roughing it, I've been doing that for years, but with all the gadgets you can get now days why not take a little luxury with you and if it can be achieved and done, and saves time why not. I spent a big chunk of time trying to get it all ready on Saturday which ate into our day a bit, so on Sunday when it was time to leave I didn't even bother cooking anything or going to the hassle of making us all a cuppa
 

chartrock

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We never had a milk frother, other than a kid on the end of a straw in a glass if milk........ Cuppuchino is just a warm coffee flavoured milk shake, mans coffee doesn't have milk or froth ..:bounce::boink:
I’m with @garfield28 on this. I drink coffee black most of the time but I have a frother in the van, run through my 1500W modified inverter, used as a special camping treat for Mrs CR and myself. It certainly does not take much out of the battery and is replaced very early in the morning.
I remember a certain guy meeting us on a site and complementing me on the great cup of cappuccino.
 

Drover

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I remember a certain guy meeting us on a site and complementing me on the great cup of cappuccino.

I remember an orange lead running to a power pole as well......................... nice coffee though.... ;) ;)



Okay, enough of my stirring the pot, :becky: its really each to their own and how to achieve it all and enjoy sitting back on a camp... even with a coffee flavoured milk shake................. When the need for my coffee pod gets too great I fire up the LRPS and bugga the neighbours, they shouldn't have parked that close.
 
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jazzeddie1234

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A little known benefit of an inverter is when you stay at a park with limited power. Barn Hill has a 10amp max draw from memory. You can run high current appliances from the inverter for a reasonable time knowing the batteries will recharge everything overnight without exceeding the 10amp limit 8-)
 

garfield28

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Ok, settled I'll be getting a 200AH lithium battery, but now the question is do I just run it from an extention cord from the inverter down near the setec to the kitchen or outside, or do I somehow try and have it plugged in with a lead to the 240v in plug outside and have it power all of my PowerPoints?

I'm sure the last option isn't legal so will have to investigate further. As stated only wanna run it for a short time for a couple of things so wouldn't bother me too much running an extension cable and then packing it away every day, as long as that can be done and doesn't have voltage drop or something
 
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Drover

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Mine is fitted as close to the battery buzz bar as I could with about a metre of 240v lead running to a dedicated, tagged RED PP on a cupboard in van, I kept everything as short as possible. (my power station is in the boot) mine is just being for laptop/power tool/camera battery charging so they can sit nearby..... its okay to run a 240v extention lead , keeping the 12v cable short as possible is the thing...................... hooking one up to the standard van 240v circuit is an electrician job that needs to be certified as if you stuff it, you can easily destroy your whole rig and/or yourself....... One has to remember that its not just the power points that are on the circuit, switch one thing wrong and zappo, you could be on 240 and inadvertantly flick the invertor on, can you imagine the sparks, smoke and flame show and I doubt the van RCD would even trip out............... An electricians job that one......... both need to be isolated from the other so neither can be operated together by mistake, only get one chance usually with what we once called green steam...

I did contemplate running a lead, under the van from battery box and into the kitchen through a cupboard and fitting a PP there for use but I didn't like the idea of a long lead running underneath even though it would be shielded....... so opted for the shorter lead, works well.... I don't get in trouble for having My Junk in someones work space.

A Note To All :
........................................... Never ever make up a lead that has 2 x 3 pin male plugs fitted.,
........................................... When cutting a lead off an old appliance cut as close to the plug as possible and bin the plug .
........................................... Never have an extension lead with only one plug fitted, a male and female or none at all ..
........................................... Lots of deaths because of the above, especially kids and backyarders.
 
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garfield28

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Mine is fitted as close to the battery buzz bar as I could with about a metre of 240v lead running to a dedicated, tagged RED PP on a cupboard in van, I kept everything as short as possible. (my power station is in the boot) mine is just being for laptop/power tool/camera battery charging so they can sit nearby..... its okay to run a 240v extention lead , keeping the 12v cable short as possible is the thing...................... hooking one up to the standard van 240v circuit is an electrician job that needs to be certified as if you stuff it, you can easily destroy your whole rig and/or yourself....... One has to remember that its not just the power points that are on the circuit, switch one thing wrong and zappo, you could be on 240 and inadvertantly flick the invertor on, can you imagine the sparks, smoke and flame show and I doubt the van RCD would even trip out............... An electricians job that one......... both need to be isolated from the other so neither can be operated together by mistake, only get one chance usually with what we once called green steam...

I did contemplate running a lead, under the van from battery box and into the kitchen through a cupboard and fitting a PP there for use but I didn't like the idea of a long lead running underneath even though it would be shielded....... so opted for the shorter lead, works well.... I don't get in trouble for having My Junk in someones work space.

A Note To All :
........................................... Never ever make up a lead that has 2 x 3 pin male plugs fitted.,
........................................... When cutting a lead off an old appliance cut as close to the plug as possible and bin the plug .
........................................... Never have an extension lead with only one plug fitted, a male and female or none at all ..
........................................... Lots of deaths because of the above, especially kids and backyarders.
Yeah definitely a sparky job Drover, I wasn't sure what was legal and what should and shouldn't be done. I don't need all of my power points to have 240v anyway as I will be only using one appliance at a time in the kitchen so if I can safely run a extension lead from the inverter located in the box then that will do me, as long as that is safe, does the inverter have a safety breaker inbuilt in the unit to cut off even if you are using an extension cord?
 

jazzeddie1234

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I like extension leads because it is a visual reminder that the inverter is in use. It's never been an issue running the extension lead - I usually have 2x short ones plugged in all the time for simplicity but use them in series if I need it a bit longer
 

Drover

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Yeah definitely a sparky job Drover, I wasn't sure what was legal and what should and shouldn't be done. I don't need all of my power points to have 240v anyway as I will be only using one appliance at a time in the kitchen so if I can safely run a extension lead from the inverter located in the box then that will do me, as long as that is safe, does the inverter have a safety breaker inbuilt in the unit to cut off even if you are using an extension cord?
Running an extension lead is okay so long as you don't trip over it, not ideal to leave the invertor running as even on stand by its using power, as to breaker protection it depends on the brand I would say, like gennies they can easily bite back... when I am sitting outside I will plug a lead into my invertor in the boot and run it to a power board under the table for laptop battery etc.......

Whenever you screw something into a van wall or floor or roof always be aware of what could be behind the panel, if not sure then don't really, while 240v can arc up the whole van, 12v just means lots of grief as well as things stop working, you can get this horrible burning smell as wires melt down later on as you throw a switch, at least with 240v things go pop when you plug in, well mostly, its not a given.... When Big Mal was in the shop for hail repair I got to take heaps of photo's of the LH wall and front when it was naked, very handy to see where things are, I was safely able to put the jig saw into the wall at the back to fit a hatch..no frame or wires to worry about.... looking at the wiring though is scary, typical slap dash approach.
 
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garfield28

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Running an extension lead is okay so long as you don't trip over it, not ideal to leave the invertor running as even on stnd by its using power as to breaker protection is depends on the brand I would say, like gennies they can easily bite back... when I am sitting outside I will plug a lead into my invertor in the boot and run it to a power board under the table for laptop battery etc.......

Whenever you screw something into a van wall or floor or roof always be aware of what could be behind the panel, if not sure then don't really while 240v can arc up the whole van, 12v just means lots of grief as well as things stop working, you can get this horrible burning smell as wires melt down later on as you throw a switch, at leats with 240v things go pop when you plug in, well mostly, its not a given.... When Big Mal when intot he shop for hail repair I got to take heaps of photo's of the LH wall when it was naked, very handy to see where things are, I was safely able to put the jig saw into the wall at the back to fit a hatch..no frame or wires to worry about.... looking at the wiring though is scary, typical slap dash approach.

Great advice as always mate, thank you.

An extension cord it will be.
 

Boots in Action

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I don't wanna spend that much Drover




I can do without the induction cooktop and by most comments it seems to be the thing that doesn't seem to make it achievable. If I can run it for about 10 or so mins for each appliance and draw say around 10amps I'd be happy because I can cover losing those amps and if no sun not putting charge back in, as for my intended stay at places at present would be no more than 2 to 3 days, and down the track if I wanted extended long stays with 240v appliances being used more I know I would have to spend the big bucks.
You do not seem to realise just how much juice 240 volt appliances use from 12 volt batteries, lithium or AGMs. The shortest and easiest way is gauge current demand, to look at the WATTAGE RATED FOR EACH 240 VOLT APPLIANCE. If it is rated at say 1500 watts at 240 volts, that will utilize at least 150 amps at 12 volts through the inverter for as long as power is used. Rather than using just 15 amps or so, you are looking at 100amps or more for that period. If your toaster or frother is used for 5 to 10 minutes or more , that is going to be a lot more than just 15 amps. And the batteries take a fair beating too. They also must be charged up and maintained at a high charge to carry such high currents with large voltage drops. Yes, you can get around these things. It just means your wallet is going to be a lot lighter...a lot lighter. Is their value there?? Only you can be the judge there.
 
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Drover

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You do not seem to realise just how much juice 240 volt appliances use from 12 volt batteries, lithium or AGMs. The shortest and easiest way is gauge current demand, to look at the WATTAGE RATED FOR EACH 240 VOLT APPLIANCE. If it is rated at say 1500 watts at 240 volts, that will utilize at least 150 amps at 12 volts through the inverter for as long as power is used. Rather than using just 15 amps or so, you are looking at 100amps or more for that period. If your toaster or frother is used for 5 to 10 minutes or more , that is going to be a lot more than just 15 amps. And the batteries take a fair beating too. They also must be charged up and maintained at a high charge to carry such high currents with large voltage drops. Yes, you can get around these things. It just means your wallet is going to be a lot lighter...a lot lighter. Is their value there?? Only you can be the judge there.

About time you turned up to say what I thought needed airing, more succinct than how I could.
 

garfield28

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You do not seem to realise just how much juice 240 volt appliances use from 12 volt batteries, lithium or AGMs. The shortest and easiest way is gauge current demand, to look at the WATTAGE RATED FOR EACH 240 VOLT APPLIANCE. If it is rated at say 1500 watts at 240 volts, that will utilize at least 150 amps at 12 volts through the inverter for as long as power is used. Rather than using just 15 amps or so, you are looking at 100amps or more for that period. If your toaster or frother is used for 5 to 10 minutes or more , that is going to be a lot more than just 15 amps. And the batteries take a fair beating too. They also must be charged up and maintained at a high charge to carry such high currents with large voltage drops. Yes, you can get around these things. It just means your wallet is going to be a lot lighter...a lot lighter. Is their value there?? Only you can be the judge there.

Understand all of that Boots, it's a little bit of home to make it more enjoyable and quick for the family. I don't plan on a big massive system like the trip in a van and the like have, I just want a few basic things on hand and if the sun is out and permits it I'll use them, if not I wont.

I have purchased the lithium battery and will get the other bits and pieces I need to get it up and running. I've got to buy a 240v charger with lithium profile, the correct solar charger and a inverter now.

Appreciate the advice, I really do.
 

Boots in Action

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Understand all of that Boots, it's a little bit of home to make it more enjoyable and quick for the family. I don't plan on a big massive system like the trip in a van and the like have, I just want a few basic things on hand and if the sun is out and permits it I'll use them, if not I wont.

I have purchased the lithium battery and will get the other bits and pieces I need to get it up and running. I've got to buy a 240v charger with lithium profile, the correct solar charger and a inverter now.

Appreciate the advice, I really do.
Well now @garfield28 , thanks for the acknowledgement and I do wish you well and many sunny days. You are moving into a field of the future and I do not have the need, desire or more importantly the funds at my time in life. I will continue to toast my bread on the gauze mesh toaster and boil the water for tea in a kettle and use my existing MPPT solar controller to meet my electrical requirements.
As you move into the Lithium era, there are some important changes in details compared to AGMs or Gel batteries. The attached link will provide you with some of the advantages and different conditions to get the best out of your Lithium setup. Too expensive for me to change over from what I have. I wish you many happy and carefree electrical camping trips. Good luck.

 
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Drover

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My home baked and sawn bread is happier getting cooked on my mesh toaster as the store bought electrickery ones aren't big enough......
 
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garfield28

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Have been doing the old school way myself for many many years, now a little upgrade to hopefully speed things up a little. I see my system costing me around the $1500 mark so not too top heavy when you consider that AGM and lithium are getting closer in price. I see some of the YouTube travellers systems are upwards of 10-15k.
 

Boots in Action

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Have been doing the old school way myself for many many years, now a little upgrade to hopefully speed things up a little. I see my system costing me around the $1500 mark so not too top heavy when you consider that AGM and lithium are getting closer in price. I see some of the YouTube travellers systems are upwards of 10-15k.
It's not just the closeness of battery costs??? (AGM vs Lithium), it is all the peripherals that need to be changed to match the Lithium requirements if you want to get the optimum results from your Lithium setup.
 
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Drover

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My greatest worry is folk getting sucked in to spend large sums on uneccessary gear and upgrades when often they are not needed or less expensive ways are possible .... I looked into lithium since touring for maybe 3-4 mths each year meant it would get used and mostly off grid but when I checked the batteries out weight was the big attraction, cost per ah for what would seem to be a good unit, not inflated by a brand name or supplier was really a bit more than my budget could carry while 2 AGMs was about $600, the lithium I liked was giving a grand a shove and it would be just plug and play with just a tweak of solar reg settings to make it happy... .
In the end I just dismantled my set up and gave it a refurb, batteries on the bench chargers overnight singly, wiring lay out all checked and once all back together things are running very smoothly, better I can't really say but does seem to be, all terminals, connectors tizzed up must have made it all happy, so replacing the current GELs isn't a must as first thought and my recent foray to Canberra with constant cloud and rain proved it to be working well without need for external charging at all or major cut backs in 12v usage which did surprise me quite a bit............. My gels are about 7 years old now... always on charge must be good for them.

The main thing is with your set up you don't have to dick around checking and adjusting things whilst camping, mine just does its own thing, other than throwing out a portable for long stays and moving it a few times a day thats it and even then its not really a must.... by the time I have set the awning up thats it job done.

I think upgrading as you have the need is way better than upgrading for a perceived need.............. when we catch up out there one day I'll show how to cook toast fast and easy on mesh toaster ....... :becky: :becky: :becky: ............. and you can convert me to warm coffee milk shakes ....... :bounce:
 

GlampinCdub

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Hey,

I run my whole van off my ute (400ah enerdrive lithium, 40 amp redarc DCDC and a 120W solar panel.) Your 200ah will run plenty of things with no dramas just make sure you buy a decent solar blanket and put in the charge, running a coffee machine a toaster may pull high amp but they only run for a couple of minutes. Induction cook top will drain a battery fast, i think off memory my induction cook top will pull around 170amps per hour using 2000W you can drop it down to like 800W. The higher it is the quicker the water will boil, it all just takes management there is no perfect way it's not always a perfect sunny day to replenish charge.