7seater to tow 17ft van?

[Anthony Hope]

G'day guys
Just after some opinions on a suitable tow vehicle for our family with 4 young kids to do a trip around Aus. Towing a 17ft expanda. The 200 series cruiser would be best but expensive on purchase and fuel. Other thoughts are 100 series 4.5 duel fuel. Cheaper to buy but unsure pf towing ability and fuel economy on gas? Upgrading our 08- 2.5lt pathfinder for the v6 model unsure either petrol or diesel.
Any advice appreciated.
Thanks tony

 

[Axl]

That's easy, Pajero.....

 

[Pace]

Why not keep the Pathy? Is it a diesel? Very capable car, was for us. Pace.

 

[Bellbirdweb]

Towing ability should be no problem with a 100 series towing a 17, I'm
pulling a 21 with a turbo diesel (albeit it chipped). 23l/100 average when towing

 

[Smirke]

We are in the process of swapping our patrol (diesel) for a 200 series. Our patrol is ok, but has no guts, especially going up the hills pulling our panda wagon. But then again, we got a dud, as it struggled up the hills towing our swan!!!
We did a 12000km drive across the country last Chrissy no problems, and this year we are doing a longer 14 week drive (probably around aus the way I'm planning it...... Oh well.).
Just remember that kids grow quick, and if you are tall and have long legs.....chances are, so will they. The disco is the only car (non people mover) that has decent leg room (and best seating position) for the 3rd row of seats, then it's the 200 and patrol equal second. Hate to say it, but our territory had more leg room in the 3rd row than the Pajero. That last row is important to me, as I only have 2 kids sitting in each row, as being boys there'd be massive punch ups otherwise.

Good luck with your research.

 

[bigcol]

for long distance touring - diesel hands down (unless you own a bank)

a few years ago, they did a comparison in 4WD Action
100 series petrol
100 series diesel
GU petrol
GU diesel

upshot of the whole article was
average city driving 15000Kms, fuel / servicing / tyres / running costs
the Petrol in BOTH 100 series & GU were $25.00 cheaper to run

but that didnt take into account long distance touring / towing a caravan / carrying a family

you will find that the diesels are cheaper to run for long distance, but the petrol's tow a lot better

 

[bigcol]

We are in the process of swapping our patrol (diesel) for a 200 series. Our patrol is ok, but has no guts, especially going up the hills pulling our panda wagon. But then again, we got a dud, as it struggled up the hills towing our swan!!!
We did a 12000km drive across the country last Chrissy no problems, and this year we are doing a longer 14 week drive (probably around aus the way I'm planning it...... Oh well.).
Just remember that kids grow quick, and if you are tall and have long legs.....chances are, so will they. The disco is the only car (non people mover) that has decent leg room (and best seating position) for the 3rd row of seats, then it's the 200 and patrol equal second. Hate to say it, but our territory had more leg room in the 3rd row than the Pajero. That last row is important to me, as I only have 2 kids sitting in each row, as being boys there'd be massive punch ups otherwise.

Good luck with your research.

you forgot to say, you ARE towing the Taj MaSmirke

I do agree with the Pajero though, lack of leg room in the 2nd & 3rd row seats
also, the dials are rather deep into the dash...........why..........?

 

[dugite57]

If under 3 tonnes towing and needing 3 rows of seats which in your case you will, then IMO, if you do all the numbers, the Pajero diesel is hard to beat. You get a lot of car for your money, and that's because they do not sell as well as they probably should because the style is a bit dated in the eyes of the motoring press and they have a monocoque body instead of a ladder frame. Unless you are some mad dune jumper this will never be an issue. So, whilst this may sound strange from a bloke who just lost a small fortune moving from a Prado to a 200, if it were not for the weight of my van being over 3100kg I'd say a Pajero would be the best bang for buck tug/4wd out there. If you haggle heaps you'll get one for an unbelievable price....

 

[Drover]

With 4 kids and the stuff you end up carrying I'd actually go the 100 series, lean towards the diesel and get it remapped.
After 2 tugs with monocoque chassis and problems with cracking I would stick to a ladder chassis vehicle especially if buying 2nd hand.

 

[Bushman]

That's easy, Pajero.....

Yeah What he said
Also have serious look at Isuzu MU-X

 

[achjimmy]

If you can make the numbers add up. Yep a paj is hard to beat value wise. Monocoque over chassis , no issue mono is stronger hands down. No idea why you're had issues with cracking @Drover but it shouldn't because of the monocoque. Only issue I notice going from mono to ladder (cruiser and Prado) is over corrogations. The paj won't fall to bits but you sure do feel the corrogations.

But depends on size of kids, your luggage and the van I don't think you'll get away with anything less than a 200 with a GVM upgrade? But hey just do as most do and be ignorant of the fact and happily cruise around

Also with a paj you need to do the rear springs as a minimum. Otherwise the bump stops will bash to bits. Good luck

 

[davemc]

Depends on the $'s and what the payload you need.
We have a Petrol Disco and 4 kids so have been looking at moving as well.
a 200 Series diesel if you can afford it is great.
What is the ATM of the 17" if under 2500 then your into Prado/Pajero territory just
Or even a Ford Territory AWD pulls 2700. Not sure the payload?

We like the Isuzu Mux although our van is bigger so we struggling payload wise with a 22 a 17 might be fine
There is the Colorado 7, Fortuner and Everest in that range now new.

It depends if you want to go new or second hand or $'s
if your ATM is over 2500 then you rule out the Pajero and Prado.
What is wrong with your Pathfinder? is it diesel?

Payload as I said is the killer depends on kids sizes and what your taking with you.
If you look at the MUX
690kg Payload LST (top of the line version)
minus
270kg Tow Ball Mass for our 22'
40kg extra fuel Isuzu TARE 10 litres fuel all cars seem to get to TARE differently so be careful
380kg left for a family of 6 and all there crap if you add a fridge or roof rack your stuffed.
If you want to put a long range tank in thats 100kgs gone a front bar etc it all takes off payload

 

[NoWorries]

I have a 18ft 2012 Expanda and a 2014 Pajero
The Pajero does tow it nicely but also will use around 19ltrs per 100 average to do this (was very windy though)
I have towed a 3ton boat with a 200 series and if you want the ducks nutz then that is it full stop but you will be paying about twice as much.
I am happy with the Pajero and yes it does have its fallback (noisy,rattles everywhere and the interior will scratch just looking at it) I have had adults in the second row and they say it is comfortable enough (one bloke was over 6ft) but I have sat in the very rear for a 20km trip and that is not the best but the kids are ok for long trips.

As said before replace the springs at the back before putting in bags and you will need a WDH as the towball weight will be over 180kg
Take note MAX towball weight is 250kg at a ATM of 2500

Also we do not have large mountains here in WA so I can not comment on how it would do towing up very large hills.

 

[rojoberry]

I will let you know what the new R52 petrol Pathfinder goes like compared to the R51 2012 model I have just traded. Yes i know this may not have been a good idea but sometime you just have to live with your mistakes or not.

 

[Bushman]

Depends on the $'s and what the payload you need.
We have a Petrol Disco and 4 kids so have been looking at moving as well.
a 200 Series diesel if you can afford it is great.
What is the ATM of the 17" if under 2500 then your into Prado/Pajero territory just
Or even a Ford Territory AWD pulls 2700. Not sure the payload?

We like the Isuzu Mux although our van is bigger so we struggling payload wise with a 22 a 17 might be fine
There is the Colorado 7, Fortuner and Everest in that range now new.

It depends if you want to go new or second hand or $'s
if your ATM is over 2500 then you rule out the Pajero and Prado.
What is wrong with your Pathfinder? is it diesel?

Payload as I said is the killer depends on kids sizes and what your taking with you.
If you look at the MUX
690kg Payload LST (top of the line version)
minus
270kg Tow Ball Mass for our 22'
40kg extra fuel Isuzu TARE 10 litres fuel all cars seem to get to TARE differently so be careful
380kg left for a family of 6 and all there crap if you add a fridge or roof rack your stuffed.
If you want to put a long range tank in thats 100kgs gone a front bar etc it all takes off payload

Pajero from NS-NT models on is 3 ton tow, so it's not totally ruled out, it just has a P.I.A ball weight restriction once you breach that magic 2500kg

 

[davemc]

Pajero from NS-NT models on is 3 ton tow, so it's not totally ruled out, it just has a P.I.A ball weight restriction once you breach that magic 2500kg

yes the fine print 180 on the ball once past 2500.. Not the only car with restrictions close to full towing spec.
Not overly balanced van.. ours has ATM of 2780 and had the ball up to 285 I have to move over 100kg to the rear off the TBM.
Fine print in payload as well on cars. Then you really need to weigh your van which I still need to

Been a few articles around regarding 3 or 3.5 tonne towing which really only be done with one skinny guy and no fuel

 

[Drover]

I'm not going to get into the why I don't like mono 's, it's substantial though.....................anyway weights all boils down to the GCM of the tug, don't worry about what they say it will tow, eg; my Colorado is supposed to be able to tow 3.5 ton BUT you won't have any load in the vehicle when you do as it only has a GCM of 6 ton so once you park yourself in the seat with full fuel and a couple of pax you have hit the magic number of 6 ton all up.......so a Colorado really, actually, when loaded for a decent trip especially with kids can only tow about 2.7 t van max, this formula would apply to most vehicles..........so you don't want anything that is under a 3.5 ton towing cap because when you do the math you will end up over the mark.........................whatever you buy unless it's been done , chuck the original suspension, they aren't meant for towing and get some decent stuff..................................saves you heaps in the long run.

 

[achjimmy]

I'm not going to get into the why I don't like mono 's, it's substantial though.....................anyway weights all boils down to the GCM of the tug, don't worry about what they say it will tow, eg; my Colorado is supposed to be able to tow 3.5 ton BUT you won't have any load in the vehicle when you do as it only has a GCM of 6 ton so once you park yourself in the seat with full fuel and a couple of pax you have hit the magic number of 6 ton all up.......so a Colorado really, actually, when loaded for a decent trip especially with kids can only tow about 2.7 t van max, this formula would apply to most vehicles..........so you don't want anything that is under a 3.5 ton towing cap because when you do the math you will end up over the mark.........................whatever you buy unless it's been done , chuck the original suspension, they aren't meant for towing and get some decent stuff..................................saves you heaps in the long run.

Another nice thing about the 200..... Toyota don't give a GCM

So upgrade the GVM by 500kgs and you carry 500kgs more and still tow the same

 

[Drover]

Another nice thing about the 200..... Toyota don't give a GCM

I see the quoted GCM by NRMA is 6.8 ton haven't done the other maths though...................but with a GVM of 3.3 t at least you can hook 3.5 on the back of it fully loaded and in theory be legal...................Why do I suspect these figures then ???????

 

[achjimmy]

I see the quoted GCM by NRMA is 6.8 ton haven't done the other maths though...................but with a GVM of 3.3 t at least you can hook 3.5 on the back of it fully loaded and in theory be legal...................Why do I suspect these figures then ???????

That's because some twat who writes the article adds the GVM and tow rating together and makes the assumption without checking facts or looking up the 200 specs! Toyota don't list a GCM for the 200, a guy on lcool has an email from Toyota stating the GCM is the combination of the GVM and the tow rating. Makes it simple upgraded GVM means more GCM mines plated 3850kg GVM and the next plate is 3500kg tow.

Check out this engineered compliance plate on a 200 with upgraded GVM and tow rating :first: