No Options Apply Water pump

MarkAW

Member
Jan 25, 2017
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Point Cook
Hi
Getting the Expanda ready to go away and having trouble with the water pump and filling rear tank on the 16.49.4 expanda.

I changed the anode, drained both tanks, 1/4 filled both tabks and emptied again just to flush out.

Filled up both tanks, turned the pump on, and turned the tap on. No water splutter or air coming out of any taps but the pump is running quietly, like it has over the years when the tanks get really low so I just turn it off as it doesn't shut down.

I thought maybe some air, I don't know. Drained front tank no problem but rear tank even though full just trickles out water of the valve in bottom of the tank.

I can fill up the front no problem, but now even though the rear tank is empty it won't take any water and comes out the filler.

Seems like some kinda air blockage as I can't get water into the rear tank and the pump keeps running but no air or water coming out of the taps. If I've had air in the line in the past I just opened taps, bit of a splutter, bit of air and then all good.

I've changed the anode annually the last 4 years and filled the tanks countless times and never had a problem.

Any ideas???

Cheers
 

mikerezny

Well-Known Member
Sep 11, 2016
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Mount Waverley, VIC
With a compressor? And open up the taps?
Hi,
the breather hose coming from the top of the water tanks are vented to the outside, usually in the water filler compartment. They are necessary to equalise the pressure in the tank to prevent a vacuum that prevents water coming from the water outlet and will build up pressure that will prevent the tank from filling. If they are blocked, squashed, or filled with water they need to be cleaned out. I have a small piece of garden hose which I put over the breather vent and just blow into it.

Depending on how your tanks are mounted you might be able to see the breather outlet on each tank, or at least see the hose going up to the top of the tank.

On our second trip out, we could not get water from our tap on the next morning. Being newbies, we thought we had completely drained the tank.
The nearest water was about 5km away. So we packed a few water bottles and hiked to bring back 4l of water. Yeah, we could have driven, but we decided to do a hike.
Anyway, we got back, had water for the day. Just before we went to bed, I tried to pump again and got water. WTF!
After much investigation, we found we had at least 60l in the tank. The breather hose had a huge sag in it and ,after driving, the sloshing in the tank had filled the breather hose with water. During the night, the air cooled, and the top of the tank had a vacuum.
Our penguin has a t-junction at the bottom of the tank. One goes to the water filling point, the other to the hand pump on the sink. With a vacuum in the tank, the hand pump was just sucking air from the filler hose.
In the evening, the temperature had gone down, the vacuum disappeared and the pump was again able to draw water.

Easy solution, ensure the breather hose goes directly to the breather outlet with a minimal drop to ensure minimal blockage. I could run it without any drop, but a prefer to have a little sag to ensure there is some water in the breather hose to stop any bugs etc finding their way into the water tank. If it doesn't clear with a couple of pumps, I would go get my little hose and blow into the breather outlet to clear the water out. As it turns out
that has never needed to be done.

We now always carry a 10l container of water in the car boot as an emergency supply. Mainly in case the water tank has become contaminated or sprung a leak. The one day I don't take it will be the first time I will need it!

take care
Mike
 

jazzeddie1234

Well-Known Member
May 19, 2016
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Mandurah
I would go get my little hose and blow into the breather outlet to clear the water out
Same for my rear tank. I often have to use a pipe to blow down the vent line when the tank is really full (water spurting out the vent line after filling) otherwise the pump does not prime and shut off
 

Drover

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Nov 7, 2013
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As @mikerezny said ensure the breathers are as close to or above the top level of the tank with no dips that should decrease the blow back, the rear tank could have some drill swirl blocking the outlet hence it won't have any pump draw, remove line and give hole a poke, if water then pours out, blockage confirmed........ your pump not drawing from either tank after giving a good run to prime does sound like the tank valve is sucking air, bypass valve by pulling of the hoses and joining one tank to pump line with a normal garden irrigation joiner to see if it primes, if not then could be sucking air somewhere else between tap and pump...

It is common for a breather to spit water way before tank is full, especially after a drive, water gets carried in to line, just stand back and let it spit.... when full the water flows from filler no spitting too high a pressure and too much air for breather so it comes back up the filler pipe....
 

MarkAW

Member
Jan 25, 2017
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Point Cook
So I blew down the breather holes. Water flows freely out of the rear tank now when I empty it and water goes into it no problem.

Still no water, air or spluttering when I turn the tap on.

When I turn the water pump on it stays running regardless if the tap is on or off.

Thinking the water pump is stuff?

Unless any other ideas or tests?
 

mikerezny

Well-Known Member
Sep 11, 2016
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Mount Waverley, VIC
So I blew down the breather holes. Water flows freely out of the rear tank now when I empty it and water goes into it no problem.

Still no water, air or spluttering when I turn the tap on.

When I turn the water pump on it stays running regardless if the tap is on or off.

Thinking the water pump is stuff?

Unless any other ideas or tests?
Hi,
I would suggest pulling the inlet hose off the water pump to check that there is water flow into the pump.
If so, put the inlet hose back on and take the outlet hose off and check that there is water flow out of the pump.

take care
Mike
 
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Boots in Action

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Mar 13, 2017
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Ferny Grove, Queensland
So I blew down the breather holes. Water flows freely out of the rear tank now when I empty it and water goes into it no problem.

Still no water, air or spluttering when I turn the tap on.

When I turn the water pump on it stays running regardless if the tap is on or off.

Thinking the water pump is stuff?

Unless any other ideas or tests?
I have also heard of occasions where the impeller has slipped on the drive shaft (broken or worn through damage when blocked?) . Hence, motor spins okay but no impeller to move water. As @mikerezny has suggested, confirm that water is being sucked into pump inlet AND that water is being expelled from outlet with pressure from pump impeller.
 
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MarkAW

Member
Jan 25, 2017
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Point Cook
I have also heard of occasions where the impeller has slipped on the drive shaft (broken or worn through damage when blocked?) . Hence, motor spins okay but no impeller to move water. As @mikerezny has suggested, confirm that water is being sucked into pump inlet AND that water is being expelled from outlet with pressure from pump impeller.
Hi
How do I check water flow into the pump.

The pump inlet hose has a screw on connection, simply unscrew and see if there is water in that hose?

Strange that nothing comes out of the taps, not even air yet the pump is running. If the pump is running what is it doing?
 

Boots in Action

Well-Known Member
Mar 13, 2017
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Ferny Grove, Queensland
Hi
How do I check water flow into the pump.

The pump inlet hose has a screw on connection, simply unscrew and see if there is water in that hose?

Strange that nothing comes out of the taps, not even air yet the pump is running. If the pump is running what is it doing?
You need to do a bit of adapting @MarkAW . Unscrew INLET pipe, Connect a length of flexible plastic hose to inlet, the other end into a full bucket say 9 litre and place bucket ABOVE pump. Pump should easily pull water through impeller and prime pump at the same time. You can then try pump with water in bucket at a lower level so that pump has to pick up water to expel it. Then replace INLET hose and connect plastic tubing onto outlet to see if pump can produce enough pressure at a low level and then higher- say 1 metre higher than pump - to fill bucket. Plastic tubing available at Bunnings to suit and always handy to have.
 

Drover

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2013
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QLD
You may have to check the clacker valves on the pump but also the inline filter between 3 way tap and pump, speaking of which,

Have you checked the 3 way tap under van, where you select which tank to daw from, it has positions for front tank, back tank or no tank, if you don't line the nearly invisible arrows correctly you will be on No Tank, No Water............

Here's a pic of the little sucker which has sucked many in to spend heaps of money on pumps and plumbing.... it can also get internal scoring which will allow air to suck in....plastic tubes off it will show flow.

1636954202861.png
..... if you look very closely at it you will see arrows showing flow........... but before spending heaps on guesses just check that each individual unit is functioning, tank water flows, valves and filters allow flow, filters in pump clean and nothing lodged inside to block/hold valve.. often ,mean remove the thing to bench and use jumpers to power it up connecting clear pipe as Boots suggested...........

A garden hose connected to a tank line with pump turned on as well as mains on certainly clears any blockages but be prepared for a mess....
 

MarkAW

Member
Jan 25, 2017
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Point Cook
Fixed it.
Took the top of the pump off, 8 screws.
On the inside of the pump top is a round button which was stuck. Pressed it a few times to loosen it. No idea what that button does but did the trick
All good now, just like new
Must not have liked sitting around for 3 months
Thanks for the ideas